[Hein]

Could you post or PM me a document or link that says SM600L has an R-value of 5.2? Thanks.

 

[jostalli]

OK I guess I wasn't thinking Thinsulate was calculated in "thickness" versus foam and other common insulation materials, which are calculated per "inch". Since SM 600L is around 2" thick that means you can only fit one layer in the wall cavity of our vans. So, that would mean 5.2 is the best you can get with this SM 600L, right? You would definitely need other thinner materials to use in addition to increase the R-Value. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Hein]

An inside moisture barrier of Reflectix bumps up the R-value. There are significant losses through the windows/windshield so super-insulting doesn't really pay off. The advantage of Thinsulate is that it offers sound and thermal insulation. Here's a nice quote from the Sprinter forum regarding sound deadening.

Sound deadening 101. In the order that you would install in the vehicle:

CLD: Constrained Layer Damper. Self adhesive material that is installed directly on vehicle panels. This is all your products like Dynamat, Second Skin, etc. These are relatively lightweight (~.35lb/sq ft) aluminum foil backed product. The purpose of CLD is to reduce vibration of the vehicle panels, ~25% coverage is effective.

CCF: Closed Cell Foam. The foam is used as a decoupling layer to stop objects from conducting vibration, that's all. No good at blocking or absorbing sound.

MLV: Mass Loaded Vinyl. This is the material that actually blocks sound, which is simply a function of the mass of the product (1lb/sq ft). Lead sheet is also very effective. This is where you want 100% coverage to effectively block the most sound. Generally anything below the glassline is going to be sealed in MLV, any gaps in the MLV should be sealed by overlapping a strip of MLV and fixing with contact cement. Anything from the windows up isn't really worth it since glass is always going to be the weak link, and there's not much noise coming from above anyway.

Absorbing material: This could be Thinsulate or similar (Thinsulate seems to be pretty darn good tho). This can be used to fill any voids, under the headliner etc. Since it's lightweight it's a good to use on the roof. Thinsulate is an excellent decoupler as well as thermal insulator. It will help with external noise as well as absorb reflected sound from inside.

 

[jostalli]

Yeah I read that on Sprinter Source.

Reflectix has been complained about for years due to their published R-Value numbers. The R-Value of 4.2 or 6 that is claimed is not for the Reflectix itself but the assembly, which requires a perfect 3/4" air space. Otherwise the R-Value=1. I don't know how anyone achieves a 3/4" airspace everywhere you need to install Reflectix in a van. HVAC installers must place plastic spacers every two feet to ensure a 3/4" airspace.

 

[mtbmitch]

Ceiling vents also loose a lot of heat when it is cool. Made a cover for these in our trailer with the pink 3/4 foam. Also bought enough aerogell in 10mm thickness to cover one window as an experiment. Big difference in temperature with your hand up against the aerogell versus the reflectix type stuff. The driver doors need to also be insulated as well as the cab floor and ceiling. The 2000 E-150 I have actually had no insulation on the door step and a big drain hole. Only took me 9 years to figure out why there always was a bit of a draft driving in the cold.

 

[keithwwalker]

Its also worth mentioning that the Thinsulate , while not needing an airspace to maintain it's R value, will lose its R value if it is pinched between an interior panel and a bulkhead, in an effort to reduce thermal bridging.

It does sound like a great product on ceilings, upper walls and headliners.

Yeah I read that on Sprinter Source.

Reflectix has been complained about for years due to their published R-Value numbers. The R-Value of 4.2 or 6 that is claimed is not for the Reflectix itself but the assembly, which requires a perfect 3/4" air space. Otherwise the R-Value=1. I don't know how anyone achieves a 3/4" airspace everywhere you need to install Reflectix in a van. HVAC installers must place plastic spacers every two feet to ensure a 3/4" airspace.

 

[keeponvaning]

For what it's worth, sound deadening is about dead last on my list of wants and insulation isn't that far behind it. I put closed cell foam on my walls only because they were open. I just cut out pieces from 2" 4x8 sheets to fit as tight as I could. I didn't fill any small holes or opening, it's a steel van, all the insulation in the world is only a futile, expensive excise as far as I'm conserned. I would never use expanding foam under any circumstances! But then I don't plan to cam in freezing temps and I hate AC!

To each their own, I say

 

[papab]

Can this be used under a floor? will it hold up to the load of people walking on it?

 

[Hein]

Can this be used under a floor? will it hold up to the load of people walking on it?

No. Thinsulate should be used in areas where it can expand into the irregularities found inside vehicle walls and ceilings. It could be used under a floor that is supported with firing strips. The material comes off the roll somewhat compressed and will regain it's loft when installed. It is great for covering exposed wheel wells because the scrim layer protects the Thinsulate and looks good too. Below is a photo. Gorilla tape sticks to the scrim layer.

 

[Hein]

Road noise is a significant cause of driver fatigue. Driving in a quiet van where you can carry on a relaxing conversation is really nice when traveling long distances. And stealth camping in noisy environments (truck stops and rest areas) is much more pleasant.

 

[keeponvaning]

Or, you can just take your hearing aid out! Does wonders for marriages also

 

[Hein]

Happy new year everyone. We just ordered more master rolls from 3M and currently have SM600L in stock ready to ship. Please call or write for more info.

 

[GuyT]

Hey Hein, I camp at Viento State Park. If you guarantee that I won't hear the train horns anymore at night, I buy

Happy New Year!

 

[MsNomer]

FWIW, I just received my order of 30 ft from Hein. Except that the #%^# FedEx guy left it by the garage door (uncovered and non-obvious), then reported he had left it at my front door (covered and obvious), it was a perfect transaction. I'm looking forward to getting started.

 

[ST111]

FWIW, I just received my order of 30 ft from Hein. Except that the #%^# FedEx guy left it by the garage door (uncovered and non-obvious), then reported he had left it at my front door (covered and obvious), it was a perfect transaction. I'm looking forward to getting started.

What size PM do you have, and are you using the Thinsulate throughout?? I am trying to determine how much I need.....I have a 136 low roof on order. Thinking about using something else for the roof....based on what I have read, the Thinsulate product may be too thick for that area??

Thanks!

 

[MsNomer]

I have a 136” HR. Thinsulate is for walls and doors. Given that i will install the max window possible, there will be little, if any, room for insulation in the mid-section panels, so just the upper and lower--and wheel wells.

I decided not to use Thinsulate in the ceiling because the height available is less than the thickness of Hein's Thinsulate, so it would get crushed, thus lessening its performance. I will use 1" polyiso board on the ceiling.

 

[Hein]

Hey Hein, I camp at Viento State Park. If you guarantee that I won't hear the train horns anymore at night, I buy
Happy New Year!

Hello Guy, That is a tall order. If insulating the van doesn't make it quiet enough then I might suggest lining a cardboard dog house box that you can place over your pillow at night.

 

[Hein]

I have a 136” HR. Thinsulate is for walls and doors. Given that i will install the max window possible, there will be little, if any, room for insulation in the mid-section panels, so just the upper and lower--and wheel wells.

I decided not to use Thinsulate in the ceiling because the height available is less than the thickness of Hein's Thinsulate, so it would get crushed, thus lessening its performance. I will use 1" polyiso board on the ceiling.

I think it would be alright in spaces down to 1". It comes off the roll at about that thickness and then expands gently to fill into all areas. This characteristic does a good job dampening resonance in sheetmetal panels so less need for Dynamat, etc.

 

[ST111]

I think it would be alright in spaces down to 1". It comes off the roll at about that thickness and then expands gently to fill into all areas. This characteristic does a good job dampening resonance in sheetmetal panels so less need for Dynamat, etc.

Hein,

Is there any documentation indicating that the Thinsulate is effective even if it is not allowed to expand?? I would like to use the Thinsulate on the roof as well, but I also don't want to spend the extra money if it will not be as effective as another product in that specific application.

Thanks
Susan

 

[Hein]

I spoke with my 3M rep and asked if there is a performance degradation if the Thinsulate SM600L is not at full thickness. He said there would be some reduction in performance but it would still be better than a thinner (lower grams/sq m) version of the material.