Ram Promaster Forum banner

1 - 20 of 73 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
183 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
TRADE WANTED: Offering front passenger bench in exchange for bucket seat

Currently in Barkhamsted CT and will travel for swap. I have a 2014 Promaster 1500 van (purchased as a new vehicle in August 2015 there are 300 miles on the vehicle) with a front passenger bench seat which I would really like to exchange for a passenger bucket one to one (bases included).
The seat upholstery is fabric as shown in pictures. I do have the head rest for the middle seat.
I believe that this swap is valid for 2015 vehicles also.
Email: [email protected]
Cell: 860-309-8547
 

Attachments

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
183 Posts
Discussion Starter #2
Just an update, I have confirmed that the 2015 model year is compatible with the 2014 model year.


Mike
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
183 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
Hi all,


I've received some inquires recently, and I would like to clarify my needs for the replacement seat.


Apparently seats can be ordered for a new vehicle in many configurations, and I just selected a vehicle from the lot as many do and ended up with a bench seat. If you went to the parts counter at your local dealer (Chrysler) to order a new bench or bucket seat you would have to know all features (by part number) needed and about an hour later after the poor parts person finally arrives at a price which in turn would lead to a resounding NO $$$$$$$ WAY from you as a customer.


I would like the following features on the traded bucket seat, these would enable a match to the existing drivers side bucket seat and also keep my wife happy;


1. Armrest
2. Lumbar support
3. Ability to recline
4. Matching fabric and clean without damage


I will entertain a complete trade, meaning all front seats if the conditions are right.


Best regards,
Mike
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
183 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Update November 23, 2015


Trade accomplished!


The donor vehicle was a 2014 Promatser 3500. The seat had everything that I was looking for, ref. lumbar, armrest, reclining, and 6 way adjust.


Now for the task of eliminating that pesky service airbag notification and persistent light on the dash-board. There are lots of ideas out there, I will find the right one and report back.


Mike
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
183 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Update 12/2/15

I have managed to collect a large sum of information not only from this forum but also other sources. This being said I have boiled down my options and my tact to solve the issue.



Problem statement;


When disconnecting either of or both sensory connections, reference Center Seat Occupant Detection Signal R281 and Center Seat Belt Buckle Switch Sense R50 which are located underneath the center seat of the bench seat configuration, reference Promaster years 2014-2016, and models 1500, 2500 or 3500 a warning message “SERVICE AIRBAG SYSTEM” appears on the dashboard along with a persistent airbag issue warning indicator also on the dashboard.


Ramifications;


To my knowledge which is based on my information gathering thus far it is not known whether the airbag system has been fully or partially compromised as a result of the sensory disconnections. This is an issue to me because I will be traveling extensively in this vehicle and I want to make sure that I take advantage of all safety features that are available.
The seat and safety configurations that are provided by Mopar whether bench or bucket prohibit the installation of custom buckets from aftermarket vendors from a safety perspective. To my knowledge after phone interviews with as many manufactures as possible the buyer (you) would be responsible for the restoration of any safety features after custom installation. To me a fix for this problem presents a huge opportunity.


Proposed fixes (thus far from my findings);



  1. Add resistor(s) of know values to the circuit(s) thereby fooling the system and eliminating the messages as noted above. This action might be valid for the R281 connection but not for the R50 connection. Apparently the R50 connection not only detects a seat belt connection (or not) but it also detects seat belt tension and under high tension/failure will initiate a signal to fire off some portion of the available airbags—this herein lies the issue.
  2. Keep your bench seat or find a donor seat and surgically remove the above mentioned sensors with connectors and plug in R281 and R50 and conceal these donor sensors somewhere. Somewhere is the question; these sensors are designed to remain contained and protected within the bench seat configuration and not (for lack of a better term) dangling somewhere.
  3. Keep the bench seat, add it as a second row of seating and reconnect the sensors at the new location. This will eliminate the problem as stated above, not sure about any new issues.
  4. I have issued and received a response from Mopar about this problem. Mopar’s answer is to contact the service department at my dealer. I did directly ask Mopar if there were any known fixes to this problem and their answer was to contact my service department. I did this and they think that the computer module can be configured to a passenger bucket seat only. They will try this at my next service—I will report on this.


I am determined to fix the problem and let this forum know about the answer.



Mike
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
183 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
I have no updates, I have not been in for service since my last post. I will keep all informed as to the outcome once I see the dealer again.

Best regards,

Mike
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
183 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
Update to seat swap issues and airbag system;

I finally went to the dealer for service on the PM. I have been working on the build and only have 4000 miles on the vehicle, but now we are going on a trip and I wanted to get some service done.

I have mentioned before that I have swapped out my double passenger seat for a passenger bucket seat, however this as we all know raises issues with the airbag system. My dealer had said that perhaps they could eliminate the middle seat through the computer system. So, after the service I have picked up a little more information;

  • The middle seat cannot be eliminated or altered on the computer system from the airbag system standpoint.
  • Whenever the airbag light is illuminated on the dash the entire airbag system is down and non-functional.
  • When changing/replacing the middle seat occupant detection switch (located within the bottom seat) there is a calibration procedure that must be done with the computer system by placing a specific weight on the seat. This weight (I do not know the value) is enough to close the switch thereby calibrating the system. This kills my idea of just getting the switch out of another seat because the system still would not work until a calibration is performed, as per my dealer.
  • The other requirement is the seat belt tensioner and seat belt switch, I found out that these are located in the buckle itself.

In conclusion I am still at a standstill on this airbag situation with no fix other than going back to a bench seat. Any help would be appreciated.

Mike
 

·
Registered
2014-159 HR in CT
Joined
·
3,661 Posts
Mike,

If you still have the bench seat, why not...

remove all the electronics sensors from the middle seat, then
put 'em in a box and stow it under the single passenger seat

Seems like all the connectors would be connected, and the middle seat sensor is already calibrated to your van. If you want to use the bench seat in the back, you wouldn't want any electronics connected anyway, so the back bench would have no impact on the front passenger seat. The new passenger seat would have it's sensors do what they are supposed to do, and the middle seat sensor would do nothing except sit there and keep the computer happy

ed
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,832 Posts
I can just hear the Italian engineers discussing this. One asks “What if the owner swaps the seat or an upfitter wants custom seats? How do we accommodate that?” The others in the room shout in unison “NO we have made that system to prevent that so the owner and upfitter will just have to live with it. They should have thought of that before they bought the van!” The first says “But wouldn’t it be possible to allow it for their connivence?" In unison “NO we don’t want to get into a hassle with the regulators in a hundred countries! This will make it easier for US!"
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
183 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Reply

Hi Ed,

Yes I now wish that I kept the seat or at least removed the components! The seat is gone and I do not have the contact info any more.

Mike

Mike,

If you still have the bench seat, why not...

remove all the electronics sensors from the middle seat, then
put 'em in a box and stow it under the single passenger seat

Seems like all the connectors would be connected, and the middle seat sensor is already calibrated to your van. If you want to use the bench seat in the back, you wouldn't want any electronics connected anyway, so the back bench would have no impact on the front passenger seat. The new passenger seat would have it's sensors do what they are supposed to do, and the middle seat sensor would do nothing except sit there and keep the computer happy

ed
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
183 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
Right On!

I think that this is the case! Apparently these vehicles are built for the bench seat or the bucket not either/or! The harness is different and the computer soft/firmware is different.

Mike

I can just hear the Italian engineers discussing this. One asks “What if the owner swaps the seat or an upfitter wants custom seats? How do we accommodate that?” The others in the room shout in unison “NO we have made that system to prevent that so the owner and upfitter will just have to live with it. They should have thought of that before they bought the van!” The first says “But wouldn’t it be possible to allow it for their connivence?" In unison “NO we don’t want to get into a hassle with the regulators in a hundred countries! This will make it easier for US!"
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
810 Posts
Im wondering if any-1 has been successfull going the other way.
Replacing their single bucket with a bench.
And have the computer happy amd the airbag light OFF and rhe system functional?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
183 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Yes, I have done that with the guy that I swapped seats with. We installed the bench seat in his PM 1500, plugged in the seat belt and occupancy switches from the original bucket seat to the new bench seat (from my vehicle) right hand seat with no errors at vehicle startup. The middle seat of the bench seat is not connected to anything--it doesn't matter to a vehicle that was built with a passenger side bucket.

Mike

Im wondering if any-1 has been successfull going the other way.
Replacing their single bucket with a bench.
And have the computer happy amd the airbag light OFF and rhe system functional?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
183 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Air Bag Problem Solved

Warning; The information below is what I did to solve the problem—be careful, proceed at your own risk.

As some may know I performed a seat swap about a year ago, that was from a bench seat to a bucket seat in my 2014 PM. Since then I have been agonizing over what to do to get the air bag indicator light to go out on my dash, this is accompanied by the pesky message “Service Airbag System”. I had a number of ideas which were eliminated one by one, the latest being seeking help from my dealer—this proved to be fruitless, they just do not want to know. As far as the dealer is concerned they sold me a PM with a bench seat and that is all that they will support—how’s that for customer service?

The real objective here is to make the system think that there is a middle seat. There have been posts about installing resistors etc., and scavenging parts from a wreck—both of these are dangerous in my opinion and just not worth the experimentation.

Perhaps someday Chrysler will develop terminator plugs or software that would either be used to effectively cancel out the middle seat, but this is not on the horizon.

For the middle seat, there are two plugs that end up empty when the swap occurs, these are for the Seat Belt Receptacle and the Occupant Detection Switch, yellow and white connectors.

While at the dealer during my last service I had an in-depth conversation with the parts guy. After about an hour of research on his part he came up with part numbers for the aforementioned items. These parts had no pictures or instruction of any kind and according to him they had no connectors! Without connectors, these parts would be useless to me. The bottom line was that he gave me the wrong part number for the Seat Belt Receptacle! None of the above was the fault of the parts guy, he just did not have the proper information.

Since we are planning to go on trips and now that my build is done, we have more of an urgent need to be safe and have a functioning air bag system—as we know when the air bag indicator light is on the air bag system does not work, not even a little bit.

To make a long story short my research on the internet lead me to speak with a guy in California, this was through an EBay ad. He gave me to the proper part numbers for my vehicle. Armed with this I performed a search for the parts and the best deal was at the MOPARONE website. The two parts that I purchased online from them were over $100 less than my dealer offered for the same parts. I also verified that the parts were proper for my vehicle. On the side, the parts guy at MOPARONE told me that he has been selling these parts to people like me who have done seat swaps and have air bag issues—go figure, this information has not shown up in any posts that I know of.

The bottom line:

Occupant Detection Switch P/N 68237023AA $75.13
Seat Belt Receptacle P/N 5RM76JXWAA $153.60

The above should be good for the 2014, 2015, and the 2016 PM models.

These were plugged in and they work! See pictures. All I need to do is place the parts in a container and securely stow them under the passenger seat.

Any questions?

Mike
 

Attachments

·
Registered
2014-159 HR in CT
Joined
·
3,661 Posts
Mike,

I don't have the situation with swapping seats but I'm sure a lot of people who have will really appreciate your research and solution!

Ed

ps. if you have some time, we should plan a show-and-tell get together, I'd love to see your build!... maybe during the Christmas to New Year break (if you get one!)
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
183 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
Thanks

Mike,

I don't have the situation with swapping seats but I'm sure a lot of people who have will really appreciate your research and solution!

Ed

ps. if you have some time, we should plan a show-and-tell get together, I'd love to see your build!... maybe during the Christmas to New Year break (if you get one!)
Thanks Ed,

I'm sure that we can get together soon.

Mike
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
183 Posts
Discussion Starter #19 (Edited)
Warning; The information below is what I did to solve the problem—be careful, proceed at your own risk.

As some may know I performed a seat swap about a year ago, that was from a bench seat to a bucket seat in my 2014 PM. Since then I have been agonizing over what to do to get the air bag indicator light to go out on my dash, this is accompanied by the pesky message “Service Airbag System”. I had a number of ideas which were eliminated one by one, the latest being seeking help from my dealer—this proved to be fruitless, they just do not want to know. As far as the dealer is concerned they sold me a PM with a bench seat and that is all that they will support—how’s that for customer service?

The real objective here is to make the system think that there is a middle seat. There have been posts about installing resistors etc., and scavenging parts from a wreck—both of these are dangerous in my opinion and just not worth the experimentation.

Perhaps someday Chrysler will develop terminator plugs or software that would either be used to effectively cancel out the middle seat, but this is not on the horizon.

For the middle seat, there are two plugs that end up empty when the swap occurs, these are for the Seat Belt Receptacle and the Occupant Detection Switch, yellow and white connectors.

While at the dealer during my last service I had an in-depth conversation with the parts guy. After about an hour of research on his part he came up with part numbers for the aforementioned items. These parts had no pictures or instruction of any kind and according to him they had no connectors! Without connectors, these parts would be useless to me. The bottom line was that he gave me the wrong part number for the Seat Belt Receptacle! None of the above was the fault of the parts guy, he just did not have the proper information.

Since we are planning to go on trips and now that my build is done, we have more of an urgent need to be safe and have a functioning air bag system—as we know when the air bag indicator light is on the air bag system does not work, not even a little bit.

To make a long story short my research on the internet lead me to speak with a guy in California, this was through an EBay ad. He gave me to the proper part numbers for my vehicle. Armed with this I performed a search for the parts and the best deal was at the MOPARONE website. The two parts that I purchased online from them were over $100 less than my dealer offered for the same parts. I also verified that the parts were proper for my vehicle. On the side, the parts guy at MOPARONE told me that he has been selling these parts to people like me who have done seat swaps and have air bag issues—go figure, this information has not shown up in any posts that I know of.

The bottom line:

Occupant Detection Switch P/N 68237023AA $75.13
Seat Belt Receptacle P/N 5RM76JXWAA $153.60

The above should be good for the 2014, 2015, and the 2016 PM models.

These were plugged in and they work! See pictures. All I need to do is place the parts in a container and securely stow them under the passenger seat.

Any questions?

Mike
Hi All,

I thought that I would finalize my airbag fix by showing what I did with the components.

I placed the Occupant Detection Switch and the seat Belt Receptacle into a Tupperware box, sealed it with Gorilla Tape and wire-tied it under the passenger seat. See pictures:

Mike
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Mike,

Yes, great work and thanks for sharing. I'd like to swap my bench seat out as well. I'm in the SF Bay Area and have had a hard time finding a local-ish person to swap. I'll keep looking, and at the salvage yards too, now that you have provided us with the fix.

Thanks.
 
1 - 20 of 73 Posts
Top