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Was planning to replace my Ram dinosaur 6.7 diesel, 2500, 4x4 e/w a cargo box with a new diesel Transit or Promaster cargo van. Started comparing these two vans and then learned the Transit would not be available until 2015.

Thought the Mercedes Sprinter would be too expensive but did a comparison just to see how the Sprinter was equipped. Surprised to learn that in Canada a base model low roof 1500 136" WB diesel Promaster cost more then a low roof 2500 144" WB diesel Sprinter.

Second surprise was to learn Mercedes Sprinter will be available with 4 wheel drive next fall. Looks like I will be driving the dinosaur until then.

http://sprinter-source.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27037&page=3
 

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4 wheel drive is great but im sure the price on the MB Sprinter 4 wheel drive model will be a lot. what they need to do is trickle that tech down to the ProMaster
 

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4 wheel drive is great but im sure the price on the MB Sprinter 4 wheel drive model will be a lot. what they need to do is trickle that tech down to the ProMaster
The factory 4x4 costs about $8,000 more then the 2 wheel drive in England.
4x4 conversions for GM Ford and Nissan run about $12,000 at Quigley in US.
Sprinter 4x4 conversions at Whitefeather in US run about $21,000.

http://tools.mercedes-benz.co.uk/current/vans/pdfs/price-lists/sprinter-price-list.pdf
 

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How much more does the Promaster cost in Canada compared to the Sprinter?

I'd think the 4x4 Sprinter would cost big $$

I'm guessing snow is a concern which is why you would want a 4x4?

Well FWD > RWD in the snow.

AWD is the most ideal but FWD can work with good winter tires. It beats RWD thats for sure.
 

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...in Canada a base model low roof 1500 136" WB diesel Promaster cost more then a low roof 2500 144" WB diesel Sprinter....
It seems to be at the small end where the price is closest. MB adds $2500 for high roof while PM adds only $1000. Didn't compare the longer models but I suspect similar. If you want big and base, PM might save some money.
On the other hand, PM adds $1000 to go from 1500 to 2500. Other than springs, what's upgraded? Do you get bigger brakes? The rear axle shouldn't cost much more since it's essentially a trailer axle.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
How much more does the Promaster cost in Canada compared to the Sprinter?

I'd think the 4x4 Sprinter would cost big $$

I'm guessing snow is a concern which is why you would want a 4x4?

Well FWD > RWD in the snow.

AWD is the most ideal but FWD can work with good winter tires. It beats RWD thats for sure.
In Canada the basic low roof 1500 136" WB diesel Promaster prices out at $40,290 MSRP. The diesel is a $6000 option. Diesel and 7 speed auto are standard on the Sprinter.

Both Promaster and Sprinter have some sort of electronic brake locking differential. Traction should be equal in 2 wheel drives depending on weight distribution.
 

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$6000 optional diesel is a lot but worth it. Does anyone know how long it will take for someone to make their money back on the $6000 premium?
 

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problem with FWD in the winter time, especially in a vehicle that will be as rear heavy with cargo as Promaster is rear slide. The front will handle fine but under breaking the rear will have a strange desire to pass the front end in slippery conditions...
 

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problem with FWD in the winter time, especially in a vehicle that will be as rear heavy with cargo as Promaster is rear slide. The front will handle fine but under breaking the rear will have a strange desire to pass the front end in slippery conditions...
Pick your poison. Contrast with a RWD van that when empty, is going to slide everywhere.

fwiw, I think RAM should of had ABS as standard on all Promasters, as it does help in snow conditions, and not just panic stops.
 

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Pick your poison. Contrast with a RWD van that when empty, is going to slide everywhere.

fwiw, I think RAM should of had ABS as standard on all Promasters, as it does help in snow conditions, and not just panic stops.
agreed. its pros and cons.

AWD would be nice but its costly to maintain and usually costly to buy.
 

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Pick your poison. Contrast with a RWD van that when empty, is going to slide everywhere.

fwiw, I think RAM should of had ABS as standard on all Promasters, as it does help in snow conditions, and not just panic stops.
ABS is not standard? When did we go back to the 80s?
 

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I think the Promaster has the Esp as standard in the US...
Using winter tyres it'll be very safe and easy to drive on the snow and ice.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
I think the Promaster has the Esp as standard in the US...
Using winter tyres it'll be very safe and easy to drive on the snow and ice.
All modern vans have some sort of Esp where brakes are used to stop a spinning wheel. Nothing unique or special with Promaster.

When Ram describes this system as Brake Lock Differential under Standard Features they are deceiving. It does not lock the differential to cause both drive wheels to turn at the same time.
 

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I think the system include also the ESP (Electronic Stability Program) wich is offered in Europe with the TCS (standard traction control) and TCS+ (traction control with auto-locking differential simulation).
The ESP is a system that control the stability using the throttle modulation and the brakes and is far more advanced and effective than the ABS.
The ABS work only when you are braking, the ESP keep under control the stability of the vehicle constantly, using accelerometers and gyroscopes.
 

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I think the system include also the ESP (Electronic Stability Program) wich is offered in Europe with the TCS (standard traction control) and TCS+ (traction control with auto-locking differential simulation).
The ESP is a system that control the stability using the throttle modulation and the brakes and is far more advanced and effective than the ABS.
The ABS work only when you are braking, the ESP keep under control the stability of the vehicle constantly, using accelerometers and gyroscopes.
so they baked ABS into ESP is what you're saying?
 

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In Europe ABS is standard (it's compulsory), after you can pay for the ESP plus TCS and pay more for ESP plus TCS+.
 

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All modern vans have some sort of Esp where brakes are used to stop a spinning wheel. Nothing unique or special with Promaster.

When Ram describes this system as Brake Lock Differential under Standard Features they are deceiving. It does not lock the differential to cause both drive wheels to turn at the same time.
It's true that the mechanical "differential" between the front axles is open and remains that way, but in fairness to RAM the word "differential" has many uses beyond the noun that describe the one drivetrain component we first think of.

Any measurement of relative speed between wheel speeds, or "difference" in speed that is controlled by applying brake to faster-spinning wheel, can also be considered a differential action. And if the brake system controls wheel speed to same level, the mechanical differential will have no relative speed between the two sides, thus no need to lock it at all. It'd be virtually locked by controlling forces/torque at each front wheel.

Not saying it's the same, but end result can be very similar without many of the disadvantages of a true locking differential. Particularly when used with FWD.
 
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