Ram Promaster Forum banner

81 - 100 of 101 Posts

·
Registered
2018 3500 Ext
Joined
·
161 Posts
I'm still wondering about cutting out the whole floor under the heater and placing it directly on the van floor... just enough room to allow the intake and outflow of the heater to be above the flooring. Still a thought... once, placed, I most likely won't change it unless forced to...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11 Posts
Anyone can buy them. They are diesel, NOT gas in spite of the listings.
I couldn’t stand the thought of buying an Espar when I could get the chinese clone for $1500.00 less. I have a gas engine in my van and bought a Chinese diesel heater. I plan on carrying a container of diesel (it comes with the heater) in my van. People do it all the time. I looked at tons of videos and bought the same heater that I thought was recommended by the most responsible looking person showing his van build. If it only lasts a couple years, no harm no foul. I think it only cost 150 bucks. I think Espar and Wabasto are ripping us all off. I mean look at the thing. There’s nothing to it. Why is it so expensive?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
193 Posts
Because they spend the $ on the R&D on it and need to recoup their money back and make a profit.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,927 Posts
I couldn’t stand the thought of buying an Espar when I could get the chinese clone for $1500.00 less. I have a gas engine in my van and bought a Chinese diesel heater. I plan on carrying a container of diesel (it comes with the heater) in my van. People do it all the time. I looked at tons of videos and bought the same heater that I thought was recommended by the most responsible looking person showing his van build. If it only lasts a couple years, no harm no foul. I think it only cost 150 bucks. I think Espar and Wabasto are ripping us all off. I mean look at the thing. There’s nothing to it. Why is it so expensive?
If you know what caused the heater to fail, can you report your findings on this thread?

The more information we get here, will help others.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,927 Posts
Because they spend the $ on the R&D on it and need to recoup their money back and make a profit.
I understand that opinion.

If I consider the $ 1,500 difference from the Chinese Clone is all R&D then I would assume the German product is miles ahead in quality & a longer warranty period for their “German” product would backup the superior quality. However I note their warranty is not exceptionally long. I do not buy the R&D aspect for a multitude of reasons, one of them being Webasto has been manufacturing heaters since 1935. I know very little of patent laws, and they are different all over the World, however a typical max is about 20 years

69002


In Canada we have a law called “The Competition Act”. IMO it is a very important law for Canada & combats against rampant monopoly activities (possibly ineffective in some areas).
69003



R&D costing 1000% more? I’m not buying that !!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,595 Posts
The term "Chinese knock-off" normally implies copies without regard to western patents and copyrights. I buy local when it's available and of comparable cost and quality. Love a good return policy. In this case, Germany isn't exactly local either, cost is way cheaper, and quality seems to be good relative to price. However, the tricks and risks of buying Chinese stuff can take some getting used to.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,796 Posts
IIRC one of the 2 were caught price fixing a couple of years ago, I think they paid a fine, I'm guessing they didn't bother to lower the price. There is no reason to lower the price if people are will to pay.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
784 Posts
IIRC one of the 2 were caught price fixing a couple of years ago, I think they paid a fine, I'm guessing they didn't bother to lower the price. There is no reason to lower the price if people are will to pay.
Yes, it was espar: Parking Heater Company Sentenced to Pay $14.9 Million Criminal Fine for Price Fixing Scheme

I think a good option might be to use two 2kwh chinese heaters, you could put one in the front of the van and one in the rear for good heat distribution. Since they are best to run on full power you could run one or both depending on how much heat you need. If one goes down you still have heat until you can repair it. Completely losing heat with subzero night time temps on a ski trip really sucks, been there done that many times.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,272 Posts
I like both ideas. I find my little 2KW unit not powerful enough. So I might get a 2nd unit but it'd be a 5KW... Redundancy is good when survival (or extreme discomfort) is at stake. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
784 Posts
the problem is you dont want to run these at 50% power, supposedly the get clogged with soot more if you run them at less than full power so a 5kw heater run at 50% power might have more issues. also these heaters draw over 10 amps for a few min on startup for the glowplugs so you really want them cycling (turning on/off ) as little as possible.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,272 Posts
Yeah, soot is a concern that I've also heard. The double-trouble is that I want lots of heat without the associated noise of a fan running at or near max. So one way would be to run a 5KW unit on low.

From what I've read, this is quite (very) likely to get the unit plugged up with soot.

My plan to combat this would be to run the unit on max for 10 or 15 minutes once in a while.

The thing is that when I've been sniffing around the exhaust of my unit when it's running on low, I don't notice much of any smell. If it were sooting up, I would have expected the smell of an engine running rich, maybe see some smoke. But no smell or smoke.

I read that Facebook support group now and again. Part of me is suspecting that soot problems come from improper installation or lower-grade diesel fuel (lower than we have here in N. America). It seems (to me at least) a recurring theme there.
 
  • Like
Reactions: afox and RV8R

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,595 Posts
So far, we've used our 2kW unit down to 35degF and still felt it was more than enough. Shiny is well insulated and has a moderate amount of window area, which we cover with insulated curtains at night.

To help keep the heater clean, we run it on high for 5-10min before shutting down, every time. I haven't noticed any exhaust smell either, when it's running. But after shut down, the exhaust can smell like diesel for a while. Probably just leftovers from incomplete combustion during shut down.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,927 Posts
the problem is you dont want to run these at 50% power, supposedly the get clogged with soot more if you run them at less than full power so a 5kw heater run at 50% power might have more issues. also these heaters draw over 10 amps for a few min on startup for the glowplugs so you really want them cycling (turning on/off ) as little as possible.
IIRC @afox for your van you went in the same direction as I did; Propane Propex?

Now that I have had some experience with a 8KW Chinese Clone Diesel in my 300sf cabin & a Propex HS2800 propane in my van; I would definitely go propane in my van & most likely the HS2800. It uses 2.1 amps typically when running.

The diesel does use lots of current when starting up & powering the glow plug. I have run it on low all night in my cabin to ensure the startup / shutdown process does not happen. In the morning I just blast it on high for 20 minutes.

@travelvanvan my cabin 8kw (if 8 is real I do not know) diesel set on low is very quiet & the exterior exhaust is very low smell. The pump pulse is the same volume on high as on low, just longer intervals. This also can be made quieter by ensuring the lines are not striking anything adjacent. So for no real issues with my diesel heater (other my error in setting the pump level - which you assisted me with). My Propex van heater has one setting for heat/speed on the fan, & it starts up quick & efficient & shuts down the same way. Just set the temperature I want (like in my house) & the Propex just deals with it. You might not like the Propex louder fan sound though - I compare it to my diesel on high (or close to that). For sound, the diesel on low is very quiet in comparison to the Propex “one speed”.

Manufacturers make the consumers the Guinea Pigs (intentional or otherwise). If we want heat, we have to pick something & set it up to suit our needs as best as possible. I would not be afraid of a Chinese Clone Diesel in a van, as they are cheap enough & I hear the gasoline heaters are more prone to clogging up the burners. I would look into “leaning” out the diesel/air ratio incase of higher altitudes

If either of my heaters fail or have issues, I will report on the forum. In general, I trust the opinions or reported experience of our forum members more than any other part of the internet.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
784 Posts
IIRC @afox for your van you went in the same direction as I did; Propane Propex?

Now that I have had some experience with a 8KW Chinese Clone Diesel in my 300sf cabin & a Propex HS2800 propane in my van; I would definitely go propane in my van & most likely the HS2800. It uses 2.1 amps typically when running.

The diesel does use lots of current when starting up & powering the glow plug. I have run it on low all night in my cabin to ensure the startup / shutdown process does not happen. In the morning I just blast it on high for 20 minutes.

@travelvanvan my cabin 8kw (if 8 is real I do not know) diesel set on low is very quiet & the exterior exhaust is very low smell. The pump pulse is the same volume on high as on low, just longer intervals. This also can be made quieter by ensuring the lines are not striking anything adjacent. So for no real issues with my diesel heater (other my error in setting the pump level - which you assisted me with). My Propex van heater has one setting for heat/speed on the fan, & it starts up quick & efficient & shuts down the same way. Just set the temperature I want (like in my house) & the Propex just deals with it. You might not like the Propex louder fan sound though - I compare it to my diesel on high (or close to that). For sound, the diesel on low is very quiet in comparison to the Propex “one speed”.

Manufacturers make the consumers the Guinea Pigs (intentional or otherwise). If we want heat, we have to pick something & set it up to suit our needs as best as possible. I would not be afraid of a Chinese Clone Diesel in a van, as they are cheap enough & I hear the gasoline heaters are more prone to clogging up the burners. I would look into “leaning” out the diesel/air ratio incase of higher altitudes

If either of my heaters fail or have issues, I will report on the forum. In general, I trust the opinions or reported experience of our forum members more than any other part of the internet.
Yep, I do have the propex hs2800 in my van. I like that the propex is extremely reliable regardless of altitude. I live in Colorado and use the van for skiing a lot in winter, often camp at elevations over 9k feet and temps below 0f, sometimes upto -20f. I consider the chinese heaters to be more like toys to experiment with. When they fail noone is surprised or really upset. There is a very active facebook group and lots of youtube videos for helping users figure out issues with them. Noone gets really upset when their $150 heater gets coked up. I actually bought a 2kw chinese diesel heater recently to play with. I know a bunch of people using them in their vans and most have had issues with them. No way would I depend on one when it really matters, that;s why I thought having two would be nice.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,927 Posts
Yep, I do have the propex hs2800 in my van. I like that the propex is extremely reliable regardless of altitude. I live in Colorado and use the van for skiing a lot in winter, often camp at elevations over 9k feet and temps below 0f, sometimes upto -20f. I consider the chinese heaters to be more like toys to experiment with. When they fail noone is surprised or really upset. There is a very active facebook group and lots of youtube videos for helping users figure out issues with them. Noone gets really upset when their $150 heater gets coked up. I actually bought a 2kw chinese diesel heater recently to play with. I know a bunch of people using them in their vans and most have had issues with them. No way would I depend on one when it really matters, that;s why I thought having two would be nice.
Yup

IIRC; you & I came to the same conclusion near the same time & went Propex for identical reasons. 👍
 

·
Registered
2014 Ram Promaster 2500 159" diesel
Joined
·
1,392 Posts
I'm a flatlander and don't need Plateau Adaptive Function, but for those that like to experiment at altitude, look at this replacement for your controller it comes with a circuit board so heater and controller can communicate. For $50 may be worth the gamble. Remember u pays your money and u takes your chances. So read up first and ask questions later. Your on your own.
As for parking heaters being knock offs I can't find patents for the basic heater just the newer controllers and circuit boards so who is copying who's heater. Even though they do sound like watered down Argus As 109-014 or maybe the Maru Ka10.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
420 Posts
Picked out this one, will fit easily I hope. Has upgraded features.
Interestingly while shopping put the different versions in my watch list.
Venders made lower offers, one went up in price, I picked a blue one, we shall see.
1606346117373.png
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
193 Posts
Are you planning to run the heater from the outside with a hole for the hot air output into the van or inside with the holes for intake and exhaust? I thought about doing that but make removable since I only winter camp few times a year.
 
81 - 100 of 101 Posts
Top