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Gas or diesel

  • Gas

    Votes: 6 28.6%
  • Diesel

    Votes: 15 71.4%

  • Total voters
    21
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Discussion Starter #1
what pm would you prefer? Gas or wait for the diesel version. I'm debating on the two. I can order a pm the way I want it now or I can wait for the diesel. From reading other posts about mpg it seems like the gasser is gonna be cheaper to operate.
 

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Just read the posts about the gas engine and it sounds like you can not go wrong
with it.
For me I am ordering the diesel ,because I had both in a E250 gas and now a E350
diesel (Ford).
The diesel just performs better without going into high RPMs.
Guess you can call me stubborn and I got my head stuck in the sand,but that's the way I feel.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I don't blame you. I'm big on diesels too. I had gas cargo vans and now my diesel sprinter and told myself I would never go back to gas. I plan on keeping the new pm for a long time. How long did they say the diesel version will be?
 

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I don't blame you. I'm big on diesels too. I had gas cargo vans and now my diesel sprinter and told myself I would never go back to gas. I plan on keeping the new pm for a long time. How long did they say the diesel version will be?
From what the dealer told me awhile back the production starts in December.
Should be in my drive way by March. This will be my first new vehicle ever
always bought slightly used. And I plan on keeping it long term.
Already put money down even though they are not taking orders yet.
 

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Just read the posts about the gas engine and it sounds like you can not go wrong
with it.

....cut.....
Agree on the engine. The engine itself is widely used on RAM pickups now with good results, so my concern would be more about how the FWD transmission that was originally designed for lighter vehicles will hold up. I've read Chrysler upgraded it for the PM but only time will confirm how well it will do long-term. A lot probably has to do with how one drives and how hard we push the drivetrain on a regular basis.

For the amount I drive I'd probably go with the gasoline V6, although I'm not crazy about V engines in FWD. A strong inline 4 gasoline would be fine for me. I'm rarely in that big a hurry to need more than 150 or so HP.
 

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I'd definitely want to test drive the diesel before deciding. What concerns me more than the engine is the transmission. From what I've read, it's a SINGLE-CLUTCH (not a double-clutch like the DSG in a VW TDI) automated manual. I've driven several heavy-duty semi-trucks with automated manuals, and you can definitely feel the pause in acceleration during each gear change. This experience is somewhat unsettling if you are used to a conventional automotive automatic, such as in the gas ProMaster.

And of course, there is the questionable argument of how long it will take to recover your initial $4000 up-charge, when considering the higher cost-per-gallon of diesel versus gas, and the additional maintenance costs for the diesel engine.

I'd really like to see that nine-speed automatic from the new Cherokee offered with the V6 gas ProMaster. Hopefully they just have to beef it up a bit.
 

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.....cut........

I'd really like to see that nine-speed automatic from the new Cherokee offered with the V6 gas ProMaster. Hopefully they just have to beef it up a bit.
Me too -- but with both engines. The ZF 9-speed for FWD comes in two sizes. There is one rated at 280 N-m and one at 480 N-m. When used with diesel engines it's rated at 450 N-m.

The larger unit seems rated high enough to handle the torque rating of either the PM's V6 or diesel. I have to admit I don't know if the transmission has the capacity to handle the PM's GCWR. Detailed data sheets for transmissions some times list a maximum vehicle mass.
 

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I'd definitely want to test drive the diesel before deciding. What concerns me more than the engine is the transmission. From what I've read, it's a SINGLE-CLUTCH (not a double-clutch like the DSG in a VW TDI) automated manual. I've driven several heavy-duty semi-trucks with automated manuals, and you can definitely feel the pause in acceleration during each gear change. This experience is somewhat unsettling if you are used to a conventional automotive automatic, such as in the gas ProMaster.

And of course, there is the questionable argument of how long it will take to recover your initial $4000 up-charge, when considering the higher cost-per-gallon of diesel versus gas, and the additional maintenance costs for the diesel engine.

I'd really like to see that nine-speed automatic from the new Cherokee offered with the V6 gas ProMaster. Hopefully they just have to beef it up a bit.
The "shifting" is supposedly what's holding the diesel up for a bit so the engineers can program that auto/manual more for North American tastes.
My guess is, and I may be all wrong here, is that they are trying to speed the actual shift up a bit so it feels more natural.
Not ever having driven one though, ??????
 

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From what I've read, it's a SINGLE-CLUTCH (not a double-clutch like the DSG in a VW TDI) automated manual.
VW TDI is nothing to brag about. Sold mine. VW gave us extended tranny warranty because it has problems.

I got tired of the jerky shifting and worst turbo lag I ever had in a car. Gas VW turbos were way better. Older tranny design was better too. Owned two of those.

Makes me wonder if gas pro master isn't the safer choice.
 

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When RAM comes out with a passenger window van I will probably go with the gas version. It will be a part time personal use vehicle part time parts hauler. I don't expect to put the kind of mileage that a business use driver would put on theirs.
 

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Speaking of that, has anyone heard anything about when (or whether) a passsenger version will be offered?

Or even just more choice with the window van? I think it's kinda lame that you can only get a window van in one size (tall & long).
 

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Speaking of that, has anyone heard anything about when (or whether) a passsenger version will be offered?

Or even just more choice with the window van? I think it's kinda lame that you can only get a window van in one size (tall & long).
A passenger van will be offered eventually. An executive at RAM said there is one in the works but no time frame was stated. My thinking is that the cargo market is the largest market. They are going after that first then as production ramps up and the supply line is adequately full they will offer other versions.
 

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Gas for me couple reasons
1) I like the pentastar in my ram
2)$6000 cdn for diesel is out of line
3)employees don't care about letting them warm up and cool down properly, very important for turbocharged vehicles.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Gas for me couple reasons
1) I like the pentastar in my ram
2)$6000 cdn for diesel is out of line
3)employees don't care about letting them warm up and cool down properly, very important for turbocharged vehicles.
I thought the diesel was a 4 grand extra? I agree bout employees not caring about work vehicles. Can always add a turbo timer to let egts cool. Maybe remote start for start up lol.
 

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I will concede the diesel is likely better in a number of reasons. However, for a type "B" motorhome, the diesel has one issue -- diesel generators won't fit underneath (and propane generators drink fuel like college students guzzle PBR), while a gasoline generator will work and provide many usable running hours per tank.

So, for my needs the gasser is better, but for almost anything else, I'd say the diesel would be a nose ahead in MPG, although I do fear the cost of a clogged DPF. On Sprinters, that is a $3200 out of the wallet.
 

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I will concede the diesel is likely better in a number of reasons. However, for a type "B" motorhome, the diesel has one issue -- diesel generators won't fit underneath (and propane generators drink fuel like college students guzzle PBR), while a gasoline generator will work and provide many usable running hours per tank.

So, for my needs the gasser is better, but for almost anything else, I'd say the diesel would be a nose ahead in MPG, although I do fear the cost of a clogged DPF. On Sprinters, that is a $3200 out of the wallet.
Diesel generators are not only bigger making it harder to fit under the floor of the low PM, but they are also heavier and cost a lot more too. However, if you really want a diesel Class B and don't want to go with a diesel generator there are options.

Some of the very newest van campers have started to use larger house battery banks in combination with a larger inverter (around 3 KW) that can run just about anything in a van except for maybe a large air conditioner. These new systems have an engine-driven alternator that can charge the batteries while the van is being driven. They are available for Sprinters, but may not be available for PM. This option is probably more expensive than a diesel generator.

Another option for those who have diesel Class Bs is to use a portable generator like the Honda 2000. They are very quiet, use less gas, and cost less than a chassis-mounted generator. The down side to this approach is that you may need two in parallel to run larger ACs and that you have to provide room in the van to carry them, as well as a gas container. Still, it seems like a popular option because of the advantages mentioned above plus they can be left at home when not needed. That way you don't have to carry the weight around. They can also serve as emergency power at home (but so can any RV generator).
 

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That is a good solution, and often used. If I used a diesel chassis, I definitely would be using two paired Honda 2000 watt models and an extended run tank, which would give me 3500 watts for 2-3 days of run time. Plus, the Hondas are very fuel efficient.

The main advantage (to me, that is) of the inbuilt generator is that it can be operated while the rig is on the road, and it is far less of a target for thieves. Those red Hondas, unless well secured, disappear fast.
 

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Several companies make lockable boxes that are hitch mounted for Honda/Yamaha gensets to run in.
Of course vented etc
 

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I thought the diesel was a 4 grand extra? I agree bout employees not caring about work vehicles. Can always add a turbo timer to let egts cool. Maybe remote start for start up lol.
I'm in Canada. We pay more for everything.
Honestly I forget where I read that now, and it could have been for the diesel option in the ram 1500, however if its a 4 or 4500 option in the US, I'd bet money on it being in the 6k range here.
 

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I'd definitely want to test drive the diesel before deciding. What concerns me more than the engine is the transmission. From what I've read, it's a SINGLE-CLUTCH (not a double-clutch like the DSG in a VW TDI) automated manual. I've driven several heavy-duty semi-trucks with automated manuals, and you can definitely feel the pause in acceleration during each gear change. This experience is somewhat unsettling if you are used to a conventional automotive automatic, such as in the gas ProMaster.

And of course, there is the questionable argument of how long it will take to recover your initial $4000 up-charge, when considering the higher cost-per-gallon of diesel versus gas, and the additional maintenance costs for the diesel engine.

I'd really like to see that nine-speed automatic from the new Cherokee offered with the V6 gas ProMaster. Hopefully they just have to beef it up a bit.
I was able to drive a diesel PM back in the summer, my friend is an engineer working on launching the diesel. The auto-man is different and you hit the nail on the head with the pause between shifts. I mainly noticed it between 1st & 2nd shifts but it is nothing that you can't get used to and to my amazement it hauled ass. I drive the all glass version so that was heavier than the panel truck. As for payback cost I had made a spreadsheet and based on the usual 15-20% above gasoline cost for diesel my figure was over 150K miles. I was dead set on a diesel but not no more. I usually scoot about 30K/year so 5 years is just not worth it and if you figure DEF, oil changes, limited places around my home for diesel and waiting until July (3 month delay now) it isn't quite worth it to me. I am going to test drive a gasser next week and most likely order one. Good luck with your decision.
 
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