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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
One of our drivers reported that when he started the PMC he got a loud beeping and the message "ESC Service .... ".

Because the loud "alarm" he shut the PMC off, opened the hood and looked for anything obvious wrong and checked the oil, and looked under the vehicle for leaks or something broken.

He got back in the vehicle and tried to start it and it wouldn't turn over, beep, or otherwise do anything except turn on the warning lights when he turned the key.

The dealer diagnosed a bad BCM on Monday 3/28/2016 (Body Control Module) and got the part and installed it on 3/29/2016, but they have to wait for a tech from Chrysler to program it. They are now waiting for Chrysler to let them know when the tech can be there.

The vehicle has been down since about 2 pm on Friday 3/25/2016. The warranty covered the first 20 miles of the towing (to the closest RAM dealer). We opted to have it taken to where we bought it and paid the difference.

I will update with details as they happen.

We have four PMCs and this is the first issue we have had with any of them. Our oldest PMC went over 50,000 miles today.

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BCM at Wikipedia

BCM info at hella.com

BCM info at Texas Instruments

I had to look up what the BCM does and the above links provide some info.
 

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Ruh Roh, someone let all the 1's and 0's out...
Good to know its not an idiot light(CEL) and that the display actually provides some form of notification regarding electronic failures. Hopefully your dealer understands the importance of a fleet vehicle and that downtime is a huge loss.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
The Gremlins are winning.

The Chrysler tech worked with the dealer mechanic for 2 1/2 hours today. Now they say the vehicle needs the Powertrain Control Module. The computers aren't talking to each other. The PCM has been ordered. The service writer says 2-3 days to get the part.

Electrical problems scare me. This vehicle has under 1,500 miles on it.

The dealer has been calling me with updates each day. I will keep posting here about the experience.
 

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The Chrysler tech worked with the dealer mechanic for 2 1/2 hours today. Now they say the vehicle needs the Powertrain Control Module. The computers aren't talking to each other. The PCM has been ordered. The service writer says 2-3 days to get the part.

Electrical problems scare me. This vehicle has under 1,500 miles on it.

The dealer has been calling me with updates each day. I will keep posting here about the experience.
I've got a bit over 5k on mine and not a problem so far.Let us know how this plays out for you please.
 

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Did any FCA representative now state that the BCM wasn't bad in the first place? Or their position is that both the BCM and the PCM are bad?
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I was told late this afternoon that we can come and get the vehicle. They replaced both the BCM and the PCM and programmed them. I will get it picked up tomorrow and post our experience with it.

I don't know if both units were bad or if they followed up by replacing the PCM when the BCM did not clear up the problems. I try to get details from the service writer tomorrow.
 

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I had a similar experience with a full size PM, Bad BCM diagnosis followed by bad PCM, followed by bad dash,then bad something else and on and on. Turns out bad dealer service dept so 5 months later with no rig I got a replacement. At the very end they finally figured out that it was all a programming issue, simply incompatible versions of software. Turns out if you replace or reprogram one module the other must match with a compatible version...Funny part is it says that in the manual the dealer and factory techs never actually read.
 

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FWIW, comm failures are hard to diagnose. Frequently, you can't diagnose if one module is not sending, or the other module is not receiving. You are very right about firmware incompatibility. That will drive a tech crazy trying to figure out the problem. So many times, the tech will simply replace all offending components with the current firmware and call senior tech support if it doesn't work. Senior tech will more than likely ask if he/she has replaced everything. The tech saved a step, but did cost the company/owner $$$.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
We got the vehicle back today. They replaced both the BCM and PCM and reflashed the Transmission Control Module (TCM).

I've attached a section of the invoice.

We did not use the vehicle on a route today. I will be driving it Sunday.

I am satisfied with the dealer effort on this. I hope that this resolves the issue for good.

I spoke with the tech who worked on it and he said that they were sending the old BCM and PCM to Chrysler so they could analyze the failure.
 

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We got the vehicle back today. They replaced both the BCM and PCM and reflashed the Transmission Control Module (TCM).

I've attached a section of the invoice.

We did not use the vehicle on a route today. I will be driving it Sunday.

I am satisfied with the dealer effort on this. I hope that this resolves the issue for good.

I spoke with the tech who worked on it and he said that they were sending the old BCM and PCM to Chrysler so they could analyze the failure.
It sux that it happened,but it seems your dealership was on top of it as best they could have been.That alone goes a long way for me.Please let us know after your driving the vehicle tomorrow.I'm sure we all are anxious to hear your report.These are awesome little vans,I have the wagon but they are pretty much all the same electrically and mechanically.
 

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I had a similar experience with a full size PM, Bad BCM diagnosis followed by bad PCM, followed by bad dash,then bad something else and on and on. Turns out bad dealer service dept so 5 months later with no rig I got a replacement. At the very end they finally figured out that it was all a programming issue, simply incompatible versions of software. Turns out if you replace or reprogram one module the other must match with a compatible version...Funny part is it says that in the manual the dealer and factory techs never actually read.
Today's mechanic practically has to be a computer nerd. Even back as far as the late 90's in some vehicles it was not a matter of plug and play as far as replacing some of these components. For example: Replace the PCM in a Ford from the late 90's, and your vehicle is not going to run until certain components in the immobilizer system are matched back up. In fact on a lot of those late model Fords, you can replace the instrument cluster, and the vehicle will not run until a module within the cluster is matched up to the PCM.

As cars became more and more complicated and reliant upon processors to control different functions, it hasn't gotten easier. Many of these modules have to communicate with each other on different buses. Body Control Modules, Power Control Modules, Transmission Control Modules, and even Anti-Lock Break Control Modules can all cause issues, and no start situations. And, they generally are not plug and play when they have to be replaced. They generally have to be flashed to a profile matching the specific equipment the particular vehicle came with from the factory.

There is really no excuse for the techs not knowing what they are doing where this is concerned. They have all the right equipment to do it easily, and they have all the documentation to tell them exactly what needs to be done
 

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FWIW, comm failures are hard to diagnose. Frequently, you can't diagnose if one module is not sending, or the other module is not receiving. You are very right about firmware incompatibility. That will drive a tech crazy trying to figure out the problem. So many times, the tech will simply replace all offending components with the current firmware and call senior tech support if it doesn't work. Senior tech will more than likely ask if he/she has replaced everything. The tech saved a step, but did cost the company/owner $$$.
I would respectfully disagree. With modern testers, it is not that difficult to diagnose those issues. You can go in and run diagnostics on each particular module. You can isolate the different modules and read the trouble codes out of that particular module. Serial links, and buses between these modules can be tested. Especially is that the case when it comes to dealer level diagnostic equipment. Their kit is designed to specifically interface with their product.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I drove a short route today, about 80 miles. Had to turn off the engine and restart the vehicle five times. There were no issues. So far, all is well.
 
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