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A VAN Called Quest Build

32K views 83 replies 17 participants last post by  SteveSS 
#1 · (Edited)
Hello Promaster Forum Community!

I have been promising a build thread for a while. Here it is!

The dream:
For the past five years, I've hardly made a dent in my debt. My cost of living is too high. A sacrifice is needed in order to aggressively pay down what I owe. How can I do that? Well, I've always wanted to do some kind of tiny home/travel trailer/dirtbag climber/train hobo thing. Let me do the math... yep, it checks out! If I sell my car, move out of my apartment and into the van, I can pay off all debt in 16 months instead of 7 years!!! After weighing the variables, I decided to suck it up and do it. Honestly, it's still freaking me out and I don't know the first thing about plumbing, insulation, etc., but I'm going all in. Phew!!


Making the purchase:
I found the van in Wisconsin. It's actually pretty hard to find a 3500 EXT window van. I flew up there on a one-way ticket and then drove back home to Texas.

Van: 2016 Promaster 3500 Extended High Roof Window Van
Price: $32,000 before tax and title (It's good for us to all share what we paid to spread the knowledge)
Mileage:500
Bells and whistles: tow package, rear 12V adapter, rear speaker wiring, uConnect 5.0 (ya, that's an upgrade?), cruise control, rear defroster
Known issues: The undercarriage had rust on everything. The dealer said that is normal, even on a new van. Sounds like bullsh*t. I'm calling RAM corporate about that. The inside also had dirt, scratches and small indentations in the cargo area. New van? Maybe the dealer used it for their own internal purposes, but a new van shouldn't have all these issues and 500 miles on it... TBC

This first set of pictures is my purchase and roadtrip back home.


Me and A VAN Called Quest just hanging out


Inside is bare and ready for the build


First stop was Lake Michigan for a little meditation



First night in the van!


Stopped in St. Louis for a photo op
 
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#2 · (Edited)
Time to plan the build...
On the civilian and military side, I do/did a lot of planning. I was super eager to get things started but needed to have some kind of plan in place or my robot brain would have a meltdown.
I made a project spreadsheet with phases, tasks, categories and status. (I will likely add a notes section as well


I also made a cost breakdown sheet to track where my money is going


This workbook/spreadsheet is in progress and I will deliver it as a complete XLSX file (for posterity and future van builders) when it is finished.


For the floorplan design, I settled on Floor Plan Creator, found in the Google Play store. It isn't the best in the world, but I just needed something simple to help me visually see what I wanted.


Noise in the driver seat while on the highway averaged about 74dB. Let's see how it progresses through each phase of the build.
 
#3 ·
Next up is the initial equipment purchase. After doing a lot of online research on build phases (what comes first, how-to, planning, etc.), I decided that insulation needed to happen first.


1" polyiso


Great Stuff Pro Gun. Don't even ask. You NEED this.


Great Stuff Pro Gaps and Cracks


3M 90 Adhesive. After a call to 3M themselves, they said this is the right stuff. (Don't buy the 77 adhesive as it isn't designed for this.)


Walk around the big saw and find free scrap wood in the back. There's a bunch of it, just ask.


Painter's tape


Zep Degreaser


6' planks


Got it all in the van

Oh, ya. I forgot to mention the construction paper. This was critical to making stencils... see below.

Let's get building! Woohoo!
 
#4 ·
My intention was to custom fit the polyiso to flat pieces of sheet metal. I saw a number of videos where people were gluing huge sections of it over ribs and ripples and my robot brain had a fatal error. I spent WAAAAYYYY more time on this than you should ever do. You can probably glue over little bumps in the sheet metal, but I wanted to make sure there would be no gaps for movement later on.

My recommendation is that you get the pieces in there as best you can, but don't worry about the lines being perfect. The Great Stuff foam will more than make up for a crooked line. You can cut to fit on the fly... unless you have a robot brain like me... then, the lines must be straight or the goblins will murder everyone.

I pulled the panels off the sliding door and rear doors.


Time to make the stencils.




A big pile of stencils with locations labeled.
Note: I now have stencils for every spot on the van. Let me know if you want them. It'll save you like at least 17,000 hours, probably.


Pay attention here. This is what makes one side go WAAAYY faster than the other.
Once the passenger side was in, I stenciled the pieces that were already mounted on the wall.
Now, my pieces for the driver side will fit perfectly in place. Extra adjusting or cutting wasn't needed on the driver side.
 
#5 ·
Polyiso Time
You might consider getting an insulation or drywall knife. I used a sharp, straight-edge knife that sliced through pretty easily but required some sawing. I have a feeling that the INSULATION KNIFE might work better for cutting INSULATION. The utility knife doesn't work well because the blade isn't long enough to cut through 1" polyiso.


Stencil transfer to the polyiso


Cutting out the pieces


Lining up the pieces in order because well, I don't have to tell you about the goblins


Last piece! This was extremely tedious. I recommend finding a workbench and a buddy to help.
My back was pretty sore after bending down and standing up 1,000 times. That's probably an actual, real-life number.


Small pieces go in and get a few pieces of painter's tape to hold in place until the 3M 90 sets.
NOTE: 3M adhesives actually require a some drying to become tacky. Spray the sheet metal and the polyiso and wait a couple minutes before mounting. The adhesive will bond much quicker.


Bigger pieces get a scrap wood piece wedged into them with a long plank. 6' works perfectly if you use the floor tie-downs.


I almost ran away to Guatemala after this... You can probably just mount long/wide pieces between the cross-beams and not worry about filling in the ribs.
Luckily, a friend helped for this part and it went SOOO much faster.
Right or wrong, my plan is to cover the ceiling "tiles" (polyiso) I made with sheets of Reflectix. That way, there will be little air gaps or air channels between the tiles, allowing heat to get trapped there.
Under the Reflectix will go the ceiling panels. Any criticism on this ceiling plan is welcomed. It just seems like a sound idea based on what I've been reading.
 
#6 ·
Great Stuff Time

WARNING: Wear gloves and eye protection when using Great Stuff.


I didn't realize how CRAZY this stuff is. This picture is AFTER an hour of scrubbing with a steel brush.
I also got some of the Gun Cleaner blown back in my eye because I wasn't wearing eye pro.
After these mistakes, I am now wearing latex gloves (Walgreens) and clear lens eye pro.
To add, now that I am much better at using the GS Pro Gun, my gloves and face rarely get anything on them.



Foam went around the polyiso and filled in the crossbeams.
This stuff expands a lot more than you think it will.
Give it a couple minutes to fill out before applying more or you will have a dripping mess.

That brings you guys up to date on my progress.
My next post will have some questions...
 
#7 ·
Questions about insulation:

There are a few locations I'm not sure what to do with. Do I fill those in with Reflectix, polyiso and GS, something else? Surely not all GS. That would cost a fortune. I also heard that we're supposed to leave the holes in the bottom for moisture to drain, but nobody is showing pictures or videos so I'm not sure what parts they are talking about. Can you help?



What goes in these big sections of the rear doors?
What goes where the wires and cables are in the rear doors?


This is the midpoint column of the cargo area. There are some fairly large sections in there.
The space in the column goes all the way under the floor.


I assume these crossbeams get filled with GS foam, right?


This column is behind the driver's seat. What goes here?


This is one also behind the driver's seat, but there is a huge section back there that goes under the floor.


Wires in the column next to the sliding door. We wouldn't GS foam those, would we? How would we ever work on the wires or lights if need be? Reflectix?


Stuff the horizontal beams running across both sides of the van with polyiso and then fill out with GS?


The rear columns have a narrow section with small holes. Fill these in with GS?
I don't imagine the panel with speaker wire or 12v adapter gets anything. Reflectix maybe? Some other material that isn't wet?
 
#9 ·
You are doing great! Do you own HD stock?;) you have to be very careful with the foam (as you discovered) and once it's out of the container it's pretty hard to remove from anything. You should always use low expanding door & window foam to prevent bulges. If you foam the inside of your pillars you are asking for problems in the future if there are any wires in there or you need to make changes - you will never get it out. Don't forget your biggest heat loss/gain will be thru the roof and glass - the pillars are next to nothing.

The ext window van is great but the heat loss/gain from those windows must be brutal why did you want all windows for full timing?

I can tell you are enjoying this "little" project!
 
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#11 · (Edited)
Do you own HD stock?;) ...!
I've been tempted to ask HD if they would "sponsor" my build. I'd put a 1'x1' logo/ad on my van in a location of their choosing. In exchange for 25% off materials and tools. I already get 10% off as a member of the military, so I'd really only be asking for another 15%. Anytime I was asked about my van I could say it was a 100% HD build all materials and tools used came from HD. My next build I may try a proposal like that for both HD and Lowe's. In my proposal I'll have a list of agreed upon items that they just don't have, and that I'd have to get out of house.

Perhaps also agree to blog or post videos on their website of the various projects.


Excellent start! I agree about the goblins and straight lines. I have learned that if I want help...that help, may or may not have the necessary attention to detail or patience that I have. I found that out recently when handed the front of my cabinets with the doors (supposedly) measured and ready to be cut out with a jigsaw. I started at one end...flipped the board around and started cutting again...I was a good 1/4" off from the other side. A couple deep breaths and realizing the cost for another sheet of ply and the time already put in I did not want to do it again, but I know I could not do this by myself, so compromises have been made. I can always fix it next year.
 
#10 ·
I filled most of the sections you circle with 1” Polyiso, No really I did. The way to do it is to make your pattern as near as you can from the perceived shape outside the cavity. Then cut the foam into smaller pieces to fit through the openings, installing the remote pieces first and adding some GS as you go. I use anything I could to wedge them in place to cure enough to stay then the last piece goes in and Eureka! I only use the gaps and cracks you bought but did not fill the roof ribs or same smaller pillars as the loss of heat in them is mostly conduction anyway. You might try to get some Thinsulate on Ebay to pull in them. DO NOT foam fill all the ribs. You will want them for wires later and the chance of bowing the sheetmetal is huge!
A bit of planning ahead would have saved some money as the near identical progun is on Amazon for $15. Great job on the free wood. You are overfilling the gaps. Ease up with that gun fella. Great work, keep at it. Insulation is often in the details. Its never pretty but is pretty important. I also wonder about the window van???
 
#14 · (Edited)
WARNING: DO NOT fill the ribs with Great Stuff Gaps and Cracks foam.

There are many videos about people using GS foam, but they leave this warning out of their how-to instructions. If you overfill (and you probably will because of how small the ribs are), the foam will have nowhere to go and it will push the sheet metal out, leaving ripples on the outside of the van. (see attachment)

It isn't the end of the world, but it sucks knowing that you hurt the cosmetic look of the van (and maybe the potential for selling it).

My recommendation is that you run some Reflectix or Thinsulate through the channels and ribs.
 

Attachments

#17 ·
Actually if you run conduit it then doesn’t require any fish tape at all! You get a little furry ball like a pom-pom called a feather (?) and hitch a string to it. Then take a vacuum cleaner or shop vac and suck the feather through the conduit and then attach the string to pull tape (flat nylon tape for the purpose) or some small nylon rope and once that is through attach the wire to that and pull it in. It takes longer to explain than to do and the cost may be nothing! Easy peasy- and I have made the pom-pom from the Ms. yarn in an emergency!
 
#21 ·
You're probably right. The warnings didn't come across "loud" enough for me. That's why I made that post with the big, red exclamation point and the "DO NOT" in caps. haha. Hopefully, this helps someone in the future avoid my mistake. fyi - I'm not blaming anyone.

I scooped out what I could from the ribs and saw moderate improvement (sometimes I could hear the air being squeezed out of the remaining foam as the panel went back into place). I'll be bringing the van to a dent place to see what they think.

Thanks for everyone's help so far!
 
#22 ·
I noticed that Acetone does a great job of dissolving great stuff foam, it's what's used to clean out the pro guns. You might experiment with spraying some in the ribs. If you have a pro gun, just attach the cleaner and use the gun to spray into the ribs, otherwise just pick up some acetone from the paint department at HD/Lowes.

Good luck.
 
#25 ·
Build UPDATE

Ok, I've been getting some stuff done. All of the polyiso, foam and Reflectix is finally in the walls. I just want to !

Maxxfan got installed. It took several hours longer than I anticipated. At this point, I don't why that is surprising to me. (Maybe it's time to start adding five hours to how long I think each task will take.)


Excited to get the fan!


I got the roof adapter from Impact3d (Hein) and it was well worth the money. :)


Roof adapter is lightly clamped down.


It looks all cool, right? Ya, but it took FOR-EV-ER.


The eagle has landed.


Sloppy, but finally done.


Looks good from a distance.
 
#26 · (Edited)
Maxxfan got installed. It took several hours longer than I anticipated. At this point, I don't why that is surprising to me. (Maybe it's time to start adding five hours to how long I think each task will take.)


Sloppy, but finally done.
I personally would completely cover the base with the screws and down onto the van with dicor. It actually looks cleaner and gives more piece of mind. And yes everything takes much longer than you think on the van.

Sent from my SM-P900 using Tapatalk
 
#27 ·
You can buy white Dicor. My Fantastic Vent has been two years and one accidental crush job under a tree in Key West so perhaps I should check it out because I know the base got cracked. Dicor to the rescue. It hasen't leaked, that stuff is GOOD.
 
#29 ·
You can buy white Dicor. My Fantastic Vent has been two years and one accidental crush job under a tree in Key West so perhaps I should check it out because I know the base got cracked. Dicor to the rescue. It hasn't leaked, that stuff is GOOD.
Good to know. The Henry 900 was readily available at HD. I looked at Dicor, but it wouldn't have arrived in time for the install. Henry reps said their 900 was perfect for this kind of install so I went with it. Ya, the grey is unappealing, but nobody's looking at it. I'll also cover the roof adapter just to make sure the window weld is protected, too.

Your photos are too big. It is difficult to load so many hi-res images on the page all at once.
For web posts, 1024 width is plenty sharp.
Haha! You're telling me that my pictures are too awesome?
Fair enough. I'll size them down. :crying:
 
#30 ·
PLEASE do not quote this entire post when replying. It will make this thread immortal...


or at least make it super long... just cut the portion you want to reply to.

UPDATE:


Someone installed a new addition without asking me. Nice touch. I left them there.


Getting started with the sound deadening mat. I went with Noico 80 mil. It is cheaper than Dynamat and both are butyl-based products.


Added some Noico to the roof in-between the polyiso strips. The roof vibrations are a lot quieter now!


All of the sound deadening mat has been installed. While manufacturer's state that a 20-50% coverage will do the job, covering the entire floor guarantees all vibrations are killed and it also protects the sheet metal.


The Reflectix has been installed over the polyiso strips, creating nice, air-gap channels to repel radiant heat. Woohoo!


Making the CAD - cardboard aided design. Remember to mark your tie-down bolt holes. I sawed the head off a M8 x 1.25 65mm bolt. When making the cardboard stencil around a tie-down hole, I screwed my half-bolt in and pushed the cardboard down over it until the bolt popped through. It perfectly marked where the hole should be in the stencil and it was super easy to do.


Writing out the plan for sizing the panels. I went with a port/starboard plan so the panels are all evenly sized and they each get two tie-down points. This also allowed for me to not drill extra holes in the van. :)


All four panels were laid out and connected. Lay the cardboard stencil on top and trace away.


The plywood is in! She's a beauty!


All the polyiso panels have been cut using the floor stencil. NOTE: I still have the cardboard stencil for the 159" extended if anyone wants it. Having it will save you hours. Does anyone know of a way to scan it and make the template printable for others? You'd think that after all of these years, there would be a website where people upload time saving things like this. Half the struggle for us van life people during the build is that everything is being engineered all over again for the first time. It's like another country seeing our nuclear program but not being given the plans and then trying to make their own. Let's start pooling beyond the informational and hand out tangible resources like stencils, CAD plans, product lists, snacks. You.. you could all send me snacks.


1/2" polyiso panels installed. Following RD's recommendation, I painted the edges with white latex (Kilz 2) paint to improve water resistance.


Audimute 3mm Peacemaker installed over the polyiso. (I installed the 2mm on the lower-forward and upper wall panels.) This stuff tremendously changed the acoustics in the van from an echo chamber to something with "oomff".


PERFECT alignment, baby! Yaaaaa!


Does anyone know how to apply a trim to this? After adding the vinyl planks, it sits almost 2" high. Do I need a waterproof trim? Seal it with silicone?


Getting the mass-loaded vinyl (MLV) and the Peacemaker installed. DO NOT use 3M 90 for this. It doesn't work because vinyl/rubber weighs too much. (See later picture.)


Just getting started on the flooring. I don't know what the **** I'm doing. The first two rows took several hours. Ya, it sucked. I was also running on fumes at this point.


Halfway there. The feeling of having some kind of idea about what I'm doing is starting to form. The wheel wells and curves required a bit of crafty improv. The multi-width planks caused me to change the pattern so I wouldn't have too skinny of a piece at the end.


DONE DONE DONE!!! I'm so happy to finally have that floor installed!


Make sure you use vinyl cement when applying the MLV to your build or the panels will come right off in the heat. 3M 90 or 08090 sprays don't do anything for MLV.

Final full-scale model of the Murphy Bed/Sofa bench/storage container. I'm super excited about this design that some friends and I came up with!!

Storage mode: Murphy Bed and Sofa Bench are folded up. Storage is accessible from the top through lift-up compartments and front slideout drawers. Under the mattress is more storage. That is two compartments with 20" x 15" x 84" each for a total of 29 cubic feet! There will also be a storage compartment in the rear of the van for dirtier, outdoor things like climbing gear.


Sofa mode: A panel folds down over the storage container and cushions are added to create a sofa bench. It is conveniently located across from where the table and swivel seats will be, creating seating for four. The sofa seat bottom folds back up and latches/connects to the bed wall.


Bed mode: The bed wall is pulled down over the storage container. Support legs will hold the weight on the outside portion of the bed. Swivel posts will support the weight inside the bed cabinet. The bed is raised back up slowly using hydraulic pistons.


Stopped to climb around on some sweet sandstone!


A VAN Called Quest chilling in Colorado
 
#31 · (Edited)
Floorplan stuff:

2D floorplan


Daytime couch mode from the rear


Daytime couch mode from the passenger side


Storage mode with the sofa bench folded up


Night mode with the bed folded down

I think I've finally arrived at floorplan that answers all of the questions. All items are as close to scale as possible. This one makes the most sense for me... but, I don't want to commit to it and come to find out that this plan awakens 11 goblins from the dry sandwich realm and from now on, all sandwiches are dry. And everybody is pissed at me that their sandwiches are dry now. Subway, Quizno's and all those dudes go out of business because of it. The upside is that pizza becomes like, a HUGE thing for everyone. Moms pack pizza in their kids' lunchboxes. Lunchables are all pizza. But every now and then someone tries to make a sandwich out of pizza and it's totally dry.
So seriously, does anyone see any problems with this floorplan from an engineering/functionality standpoint?

Life Stuff:

Full disclosure? I got burned out trying to get the floor finished before my Colorado trip. It really emptied my tanks. I took two weeks off and am getting back into build mode.


All of my furniture has been sold.
I threw out 5 full trash bags of things that can't be given away or sold.
3 full trash bags were donated.
A pile of items are set aside to try and sell.
I am sleeping on a mattress topper pad and a new person moves into my room on the 16th. Duuude!! I need to get the bed built and electrical wired pretty fast!!!
Anyone in Dallas want to make some money helping me get into my van? I need a savvy carpenter to help speed the build up. :)
 
#32 ·
I’m sure it will work. I will post only one thought to consider before you build it.

Personally I dislike having to rearrange/put away/get out stuff so even our sliding collasible bed/couch can remain open when we camp and the portable stove can stay on the galley top or reside in the sink if we decide to move the van. Due to that preference I would think hard about having to reconfigure/get out/put away the bed and the table. If you want to do that fine, I wouldn’t. I have seen some longitudinal beds that are a couch during the day and don’t need to be reconfigured at all. If you could fit the microwave and refrigerator on the galley side the bed could move back enough to have a permanent table. Not trying to rain on your sandwich but I just keep thinking about living it that van.
 
#34 · (Edited)
... I have seen some longitudinal beds that are a couch during the day and don’t need to be reconfigured at all.
My couch/bed setup might work for you.

The couch is 24" deep with fill storage underneath. A one-second slide of the top and it transitions to a 30" wide bed. During the day, for a quick nap or sitting down, the 24" works fine.... at night, the 30" width is very comfortable with plenty of room to roll and turn over. The sliding top is very un-mechanical and easy to build.



early stages of build....



It appears to be only as wide as your murphy + bench combo... might be worth considering. I can email a pdf with dimensions if you're interested.

Please put the floorplan pics in the floorplans thread when you get a chance.... nice design.

As Ms says, the straight back is not comfortable as a couch, so I have come up with a few brackets to hold my back cushion up about 6" to make it more comfy... works like the 15 degree thing.
 
#36 ·
Wow! I want to complement you on how much your plan has improved and your willingness to modify, you are also smart, talented, good looking and brave to give up your rental and commit to the Van.

Oh my, all those complements have made me ill. I’m not used to such gratuitous positive stroking. Perhaps taking a couple of curmudgeon pills, and a mental pause will return me to my gruff reality.
 
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